firestone firehawk indy 500 vs michelin pilot sport 4sfirestone firehawk indy 500 vs michelin pilot sport 4s

My logic was exactly as your's was, i.e., daily driver tire, a few HPDE events each year, value, etc. Im running them on 18x8 could I fit a 245 or 255 cuz Id definitely go wider if possible. Summer tires tend to be quite expensive for their sports qualities, but it doesnt mean there are no cheaper alternatives. I have a set of firehawks on two different cars, no complaints for how i use the tires Mod list here deadmilenko Registered 2013 Oxford White Focus ST3 I've been told that the Firestone is not worse . Although Sport 4S faces more rolling resistance yet its sturdy tread composition makes it a more durable summer tire in comparison. But the GT-R doesn't actually use the most mechanically sophisticated type of AWD systems discussed in the previous article, namely a "true" AWD with a centre differential. The Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 is a Ultra High Performance Summer tire designed to be fitted to Passenger Cars. I have put 12000km on them (this includes 3 autocross sessions) and they will only last about 3-4k more until hitting the wear bars, based on my estimations. Lastly, for the fuel consumption, this may not be the main concern for high-performance tire drivers but can be good information on how much they set you back. With a UTQG rating of 300 AA A, expect top-of-the-line traction and temperature control with the Michelin Pilot Super Sport. Allrightsreserved. Imo tire size would make more difference here. I run Firestone Indy 500 on my E30 and Michelin Pilot SS on my m3. From roaring engines and swift aerodynamics to the driver, all significantly contribute to speed. The aspect ratio of the tire is 35 with a load index of 94. Overall, all-season is best for road versatility and traction and yearlong, while summer high-performance tires are great for sports handling and mild weather. All Rights Reserved. TireWheelGuide.com is made by a team of enthusiasts who has more than 10 years of experience in the tire industry, Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 vs Michelin Pilot Super Sport, Continental ExtremeContact DWS 06 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Continental ExtremeContact Sport vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Firestone FR710 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Michelin Defender LTX M/S vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Michelin Defender T+H vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Michelin Pilot Sport 3 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Yokohama ADVAN Sport V105 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Bridgestone Potenza S007A vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Goodyear Eagle F1 SuperSport vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, BFGoodrich g-Force COMP-2 A/S vs Firestone Firehawk Indy 500, Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3+ vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Pirelli P Zero vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric 5 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Pirelli P Zero PZ4 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Michelin Pilot Super Sport vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 vs Continental ExtremeContact DWS 06, Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric 2 vs Firestone Firehawk Indy 500, Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 3, Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric 5 vs Firestone Firehawk Indy 500, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Firestone Firehawk Indy 500, Michelin CrossClimate+ vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Bridgestone Potenza S001 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Goodyear Assurance All-Season vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Nexen N FERA AU7 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Bridgestone Turanza QuietTrack vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Falken Azenis FK510 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Bridgestone DriveGuard vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Continental ContiSportContact 5P vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S. Michelin pilot sport 4s vs Firestone firehawk Indy 500. votes Michelin pilot sport 4s Firestone firehawk Indy 500 Voting closed r/CanyonBikes Endurace CF7 SL SRAM wheelset. We recommend summer tires with their maximum grip if you wish to improve handling. including some simple diagrams to show where the power goes and how much. It's very sticky like the RT615k+, but with a . Thread starter myjaja; Start date Mar 26, 2018; Watchers 8; 1; 2; Next. The internal structure of the Indy 500 is made of a high-turnup polyester casing or two plies in some sizes with twin high-tensile steel belts beneath it. It also has a decent UTQG rating of 340-A-A. Achilles 122; Achilles 123 S; Achilles 2233; Achilles ATR Sport; Achilles ATR Sport 2; Achilles Desert Hawk H/T; Achilles Desert Hawk H/T 2; Achilles Desert Hawk UHP; Achilles Win As promised, this post will focus on specific cars and what AWD systems they use, especially ones that that have more or less been defined by their AWD systems, and the best place to start may be with a bombshell; the Nissan GT-R. Nissan GT-R (R35) The GT-R has built a reputation around having monster traction and very approachable performance, thanks to its AWD system - Advanced Total Traction Engineering System for All-Terrain (ATTESA) - and what it can do for you. But, continue reading, and lets find out which brand is better for you Michelin vs Firestone. In comparison to the MPSS, my feedback is that they are: In that case then you are good with the Indy 500. How Far Can You Drive on a Flat Tire? So after three Track Days with the new Firehawk Indy 500, I have to say the wear is great. Firehawk indy 500 has a section width of 255mm and a rim diameter of 18 inches. Hmmm! Also, arent the Indy 500 summer tires? Bridgestone Dueler H/T 684 vs Toyo Proxes ST; Michelin Pilot Sport 4 SUV vs Toyo Proxes ST; Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 vs Toyo Proxes ST; Toyo Proxes ST vs Yokohama PARADA Spec X; Toyo Proxes ST vs Goodyear EfficientGrip 2 SUV; Hankook Ventus ST RH06 vs Toyo Proxes ST; Vredestein Quatrac Pro vs Toyo Proxes ST; Hankook Kinergy 4S2 vs Toyo Proxes ST When talking about Firestone vs Michelin tires, they are among the most popular tires worldwide. Meanwhile, Bi-compound Technology ensures superb cornering capabilities. Cheaper doesnt always mean bad because, in our opinion, the main difference between Firehawk Indy 500 and Michelin Pilot Super Sport is their price. If you don't mind a small performance drop, I'd definitely recommend the Firestone Indy 500's. While this wont bother you on the racetrack due to roaring engines, it can get very noticeable during casual rides. I would also add that the PS4S feels softer and is a more comfortable tire in terms of ride quality. By all means, both tires arent terrible at containing noise, but if its a primary concern, its probably best to invest in touring tires, which are much smoother than summer tires. (TermsofUse,PrivacyPolicy, Manage Consent, Do Not Sell My Data). Michelin Crossclimate 2 vs Premier A/S A Brief Comparison, BF Goodrich Advantage T/A Sport LT vs Michelin Defender. Until next time! I think these are great tires for the money and definitely worth considering. Haven't read all the previous replies, but don't count out the Firestone Firehawk Indy 500. Due to different demands, manufacturers can make tires with varying characteristics. Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 Ultra High Peformance Tire 95 W Extra Load 62 8 offers from $200.84 MICHELIN Pilot Sport 4 S Performance Radial 94Y 20 10 offers from $293.91 From the manufacturer Firestone Tires: Ready for any challenge 45 degrees and the traction control comes on with the PS4. Happened to choose these over RE-71's on a really wet autocross day and they were amazing in the wet! GTR vs Evo X vs STI: which has the best AWD system? Plugging vs Patching, Kumho Crugen HP71 vs Michelin Defender: A Brief Comparison, What Does PSI in Tires Mean? However, if your new Firehawk Indy 500 tire has a manufacturing defect, Firestone offers a 5-year service and materials coverage, with a free replacement for the first 3 years. I like that they're cheap too. I bought the Pilot Sport A/S 4 last year. - renamed Bridgestone Potenza RE003 . Looking for a credit card? Wheels / Tires -- Sponsored by The Tire Rack, https://tires.tirerack.com/tires/200%20Treadwear. About 5lbs per tire difference. The pilot super sports were on closeout and even the new 4s was only an extra $20 per tire for like 2 months lol. I hope you narrowed down your choice. TireWheelGuide.com is made by a team of enthusiasts who has more than 10 years of experience in the tire industry, Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 vs Michelin Pilot Super Sport, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Falken Azenis FK510, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Yokohama ADVAN Sport V105, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 3 PS3, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Bridgestone Potenza S001, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Continental ContiSportContact 5P, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 3, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric 5, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Michelin Primacy MXM4, BFGoodrich g-Force COMP-2 A/S vs Firestone Firehawk Indy 500, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3+, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Continental ExtremeContact DWS 06, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Goodyear Eagle F1 SuperSport, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Kumho Ecsta PS31, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Hankook Ventus V12 evo2, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Michelin Premier A/S, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Toyo Proxes T1 Sport, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Pirelli Cinturato P7, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Michelin Primacy 3, Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 vs Continental ExtremeContact DWS 06, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Michelin CrossClimate, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Michelin CrossClimate+, Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric 2 vs Firestone Firehawk Indy 500, Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 vs Michelin Pilot Sport 3, Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric 5 vs Firestone Firehawk Indy 500, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Michelin Defender LTX M/S, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Hankook Ventus S1 evo2, Michelin Pilot Sport 4 vs Cooper CS5 Grand Touring. Overall, Michelin wins in this comparison. This wont help you any, but I remember having a set of Indy 500's on one of my old cars and getting stuck in a literal. The price was far better than a new set of RE-71R's, a little more than half, and local Time Attack rules (Canadian Automobile Sport Clubs) recently made 180 and 200 TW tires equivalent, meaning no PAX or PIP point penalty for going with 180 TW tire like the Pilot Sport Cup 2's. Previous Thread | Next Thread Posting Rules You may not post new threads You may not post replies Interesting points here and having run both tires I feel from all out performance, both dry and wet, the Indy 500 really does not compare to the PS4S. Ive found the PS4s have increased wet traction at the expense of dry and cold traction vs the PSS. It can be subjective based on the drivers preference, but if you wish for sports handling, a set of good summer tires will be a great pair. Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2's vs Bridgestone Potenza RE-71R's, 2020 G80 BMW M3 to bring More Than 500 hp, AWD, Lamborghini Aventador LP 770 SVJ Nurburgring Record (Video), How Limited Slip Diffs Make You Faster on Track, 2007 Saleen Mustang S281 SC Super Shaker Track Review, Michelin PSS vs Firestone Indy 500 Track Review. I came across a lightly used set with only a few hundred miles and no track time; 305/30/19 takeoffs from a GT Performance Pack Level 2 (GT PPL2). As a performance tire, Firehawk and Michelin can only put a 50,000 miles tread warranty for these tires, which is lower than typical A/S variants. I'm actually torn between putting some up front on my car or if I'm going to breakdown and finally give some Michelin Pilot Sport 4s a try. Firestone vs Michelin Tractor Tires I also think that the PS4S handles low temps (under 40 degrees) a little better. X 2 on the Firestone Firehawk Indy 500's. Installed them a month ago on my 2010 Challenger SRT8 and am extremely satisfied with these tires. Indy 500 is also quite a durable tire because of its durable internal construction. Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 Full Tire REVIEW | BEST Tire bang for buck?!? It has superior technology and some of the best tires in the market. Tire Reviews Dry Grip 84% Wet Grip 74% Road Feedback 80% Handling 83% Wear 75% Comfort 76% Buy again 87% Summary Tire review data from 8 tire reviews averaging 80% over 95,300 miles driven. I might have to give these a try when the PSS wear out on my car. Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3 vs. Firestone Firehawk Indy500 As I have 16-inch rims on my Miata, my choices for performance tires with good thread life are quite limited. for 245/40r18. Yes. Indy 500's are slightly more grippy than the PS4S but (not my personal experience) they have a reputation for letting go more aggressively at their limits with less warning than many other Ultra Summers. I knew my 71R's were getting very worn before the season started and likely wouldn't last the whole season, even this short one. It is not a place to buy/sell/trade or spread negativity/hate. Michelin tires are premium quality, so they fetch a higher price. As dedicated racing tires, expect superb dry performance across all boards. This technology also reduces the tires weight to be comparatively 10% lighter than similar tires of the same size. 0.0 (0) Reviews. Find the card that fits your needs with our handy comparison tool. If you also have the same goal, lets see which tire will be the better choice here. While an Indy car tire cost is more manageable, it's not exactly the best economical choice. I've yet to break these free or make them squeal. Price wise the Indy 500 but Ive heard enter things about the pilot sport. Im curious but I dont want to skew the results, Me too. Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 vs Michelin Pilot Super Sport, which is better? It is still responsive and easy to control, so drivers have complete freedom over their performance. The Indy 500's are not comparable in terms of max performance. However, the Michelin Pilot Sport 4S is better in almost all categories, from wet and dry traction to comfort to even treadwear. Fellow Canuck! I don't think ps4s give anything up to pss plus ps4s is pss with a 4 in it so ya that's science, My opinion: If you want a tire that will do it all - including handling the occasional track day, and you don't want to get a dedicated tire for the track, get the Michelins. Pilot Sport 4 is a sports tire with a symmetrical tread design. When crafting this racing tire, Firestone ensured that the Firehawk Indy 500 came equipped with advanced technologies and enhancements to allow it to perform at a high level. Sign up now. You cant go wrong with any of these tires if youre looking to shred some rubber on the racetrack or on the open road on a sunny day. I hopped on the Indy 500 tip just as I had ran through my Sumis like nothing. The Firehawk Indy 500 and Michelin Pilot Super Sport are good options if you want a responsive tire or get sporty handling on both dry and wet roads. It's more of a 10% increase in performance for a 40% in price. They were directional. Benzagel 5% benzoyl peroxide Wash, 85 ML $2.97 - 57% off. For dry performance, these Michelin and Firestone summer tires are among the best in the business. Been reading some pretty good reviews about these Firestone Firehawk Indy 500's and they're half the cost of the Michelins and I was wondering if anyone has any experience running these two tires and how they compare as far as Grip, noise and wear. If this is your first visit, be sure to In 1903, Firestone was making its own tires, which became an instant hit. Thats because there isnt a mileage warranty for all Firestone Indy 500 sizes and speed ratings. S4 B8.5 no track, just enjoying spirited driving. Group 'Luxe' Oils already from 13.96 $ Compare the best deals for 61 Oils in the United States and save your money | Tires-online.net The LE3s predecessor is as reliable too and is competitive if we try a Firestone Destination LE2 vs Michelin Defender differentiation. (function() { This means that the tire can withstand intense heat generated from speeds as high as over 115 miles per hour and high g-forces. Some people may want high versatility, while some want the best handling and road performance. Sport handling is one of the main characteristics of high-performance tires such as firestone Firehawk Indy 500 Vs Michelin Pilot Super Sport. There is nothing we can complain about for their dry road performance. The. They'll last you a long time as DD's, handle well, run relatively quiet, overheat rarely in Autocross on stock vehicle, and even get you home in inclement weather. Just bought the HTR ZIIIs. A complete fluke. The vast majority of us don't track the car. I've run them on a few vehicles (summer temps only) for mostly daily driving but also a free autoX events a month and maybe a couple lapping nights a summer as well. However, the Defender wins this one, since it has better dry and wet traction. Michelin Pilot Super Sport Tires - 285/35R20 or 305/30R20 . hs.src = ('//s10.histats.com/js15_as.js'); On the other hand, the Michelin Pilot Sport 4s also offers a symmetrical tread pattern with a closed shoulder design for maximum contact with the surface. How would a Mustang 3.5L EcoBoost compare to the 5.0L V8? For that price range they are good but once you start spending a more money they are nothing special and there are plenty of tires out there which are better, I have been in cares at autoX who run these tires & i was unimpressed but that's racing. As the official tire for the coveted racing event, the Indianapolis 500, the Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 is a superb tire built for speed and maximum performance. That being said I believe the Ps4s have slightly longer treadlife and very good performance on wet surfaces due to the oil used in the compound and are well known in the canyon carver communities. But I agree with you. They are ideal for drivers who want a sporty driving experience. Not sure why someone said "if you care about handling" buy the 4S. Along with superb built quality, the tread depth is also very good ten 32nds (Michelin Pilot Sport 3, Continental ContiSportContact 5, and Pirelli P Zero Rosso) and performed better (as expected though since the other tires a much older design . Another good comparison would be the Firestone Destination LE3 vs Michelin Defender, particularly the Defender LTX M/S. It has an optimal tread design with asymmetry for better road grip. For 80 years, Firestone dominated the U.S. tire industry and at one point was acquired by its now parent company, Bridgestone, in 1989. Heres a thread from a month or so a to that was pretty detailed. Just by the name itself, racing enthusiasts can recognize this tire immediately. Meanwhile, the Michelin Pilot Super Sport has a short 30,000-mile warranty. Spring and summer are just around the corner and I'm looking for some fresh rubber. It has center circumferential grooves with Pulse Groove Technology for water evacuation, combined with two additional circumferential grooves to enhance water evacuation and improve stopping distance, even on wet surfaces. Some posts may contain affiliate links. Tires for passenger vehicles 255 in auto parts online store 2407.pl Wide range of spare parts Good price Fast shipping Hotline 8:00-21:00 I'm like 42lbs wheel and tire 19x10 and 255/35/19 michelin pss. Also if anyone know a good place to Oder them thanks 11 votes Michelin pilot sport 4s Firestone firehawk Indy 500 Vote You must be logged in to vote As a result, it wears rate is higher than FK510. Firehawk INDY 500 vs. Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 4 Spring and summer are just around the corner and I'm looking for some fresh rubber. I've had both. Right off the bat, you wont be disappointed with the performance of both tires. Continental ProContact TX. Keep an eye out for our useful guide! Join me in wishing them the best of luck this upcoming racing season! And like all summer tires, Michelin heavily emphasized grip and handling with this one. If people are looking for a budget friendly performance, I really think the Yokohama Advan Apex V601 is one to look at. Learn more at our resource centre. . Instead, it uses a clutch pack to transfer power. It used to be called the indu 500 wideoval, and they were as you say, not great in the dry and terrible in everyrhng else. But what if Well, it seems we are closer than ever to finding out the answer to that question. Firestone is an American company owned by the Japanese tire maker Bridgestone. Yeah Im looking more for a summer tire cuz I had the stocks with winter tire. Compared the similar offerings such as the Bridgestone Potenza RE-71R or the Michelin Pilot Super Sport, the Falken RT615k+ is cheaper. Fast forward to today, Michelin is the second largest tire company in the world, with Bridgestone taking the top spot, which, coincidentally, is the parent company of its competitor in this discussionFirestone. From reading previous reviews, there is nothing new here, really, except I find them to be much more fun than the PS4S. Super happy with my purchase! It is W speed rated and the UTQG rating of the tire is 340AA. If you're going to be spending a lot of time at the track - get the Indys for the street, then get cheap beater wheels and stick a set of RS4s on them for the track. Hercules Tires vs Michelin: Which Suits You Best? Your whole post is about comparing two completely different tires in different sizes. It is joined with nylon reinforcement to give you responsive handling and high-speed ability. The wet performance is the main difference because it becomes hard to control the Indy 500 on the damp road as it is not as stable and confident as Pilot Super Sport, which behaves the same as on the dry surface. The tire has this quite aggressive look that we find many people are fond of. If you want the best of the two, Michelin is still leading the game. tirewheelguide.com is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. These are parts of the reason why Michelin tires are quite expensive, yet theyre what makes them so excellent as well. Michelin Pilot Sport 4 SUV vs Toyo Proxes ST; Firestone Firehawk Indy 500 vs Toyo Proxes ST; Toyo Proxes ST vs Yokohama PARADA Spec X; Continental ContiMaxContact MC6 vs Toyo Proxes 4; Toyo Proxes 4+ vs Toyo SNOWPROX S 942; Toyo Proxes ST vs Goodyear EfficientGrip 2 SUV; Hankook Ventus ST RH06 vs Toyo Proxes ST; Vredestein Quatrac Pro vs Toyo . f, Ever wonder how a 3.5 litre EcoBoost might fair against the 5.0 litre V8 in the Mustang? Surprisingly, these tires also suffer from one minor drawback, and it is about the stiff compound. However, Firestone is more affordable and is a great budget option. And the PSS lasted twice as long. The indy is a good tire for the price but does not compare to the higher end tires. Price wise the Indy 500 but I've heard enter things about the pilot sport. Wet performance is, I also hear very good things about the Goodyear F1 Eagle Supersport, when I swap up to 275/35 and 255/35 I'm thinking of Goodyear or Michelin Cup 2 / PS4S / PSS. 2015 Daytona S5 - Madico Ceramic Tint 35/20 - 6 Speed - Mods - Sprintbooster V3 - APR Stage II - Dual Pulley - CPS Cooler - Eurocode ST Shifter - EuroImpulse weighted knob - USP SS Clutch Line - 034 SD Engine Mounts - 034 Trans Mount Insert - 034 rear SB - CR-15 - ORT Coilovers - SPC Front CAs - IE Non Res Downpipes - AWE touring w/ 102 tips - CTS intake - ECS Streat Shield - Deval CF Splwitter/Rear Valance - Signature SV901 Forged 19x10.5 wheels - 275/35 Mich PS4S Tires. One tire to work in all conditions, one tire to rule them all. And how many miles you get? While Indy 500 is impressive on a dry road, this tire tends to be aggressive on damp roads. 2014 S4 | MGM | 6MT | ABG | ACC | ADS | AFS | ASA | B&O | MMI | Sport Diff | 034 Single Pulley SII | 034 Adjustable UCAs, Toe Arms, Front + Rear Endlinks | 034 LCAs | 034 Strut & Engine Mounts | 034 Trans Mount + Insert | AWE Touring + Res DPs | Bilstein PSS10 | CR15 | G5-r | H&R Sways | Merc HX | P3 | Ringer S3+ Clutch & FW. Yes and no. Tags: None antknee Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2020 Posts: 383 Location: Cliffside Park, NJ #2 Are Firehawk Indy 500 and Michelin Pilot Super Sport good? But Ill have to check out the continental, Check out bf Goodrich comp 2. Now: 2017 Corvette Grand Sport, 2021 AMG C63 S sedan Past: 2011.5 M3 sedan ZCP. The Firestone Tire & Rubber Company is an American manufacturer, founded by Ohio native Harvey S. Firestone in 1900. The Bridgestone Potenza, Pirelli Pzero, etc. Everything from 29 to 72 and blasting rain to pure sun (welcome to Missouri). $270.83. Yes the Michelins are better, they should be for the price, but they're not twice as good as the indy500s even though they cost nearly twice as much. I have Bridgestone's 255/45/18's on the rear. I feel like they have a wider operating temperature and more straight line grip. Just for appearances? I have a 2018 Ecoboost Perf Pack car and I just went through the EXACT same thought process as you. So the All season tire will have better wet/cold weather grip but the indy 500 will have better dry/summer grip however still have decent wet weather grip.

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